Limits

"Conventional wisdom" (those truisms that too-often aren't true) says "children need limits," and that good parents have lots of limits (the more limits the better the parent). We've all seen (and some have been in) families where stifling limits caused the very problems they were expected to prevent. But without a counter-mantra to "children need limits" it's easy for parents to fear that it must be true or people wouldn't keep saying it.

If by "limits" people mean "safe boundaries," sure! If by "limits" people mean "someone to watch and care," absolutely! But what people usually mean by "limits" is parents who say "no / don't / stop / forget it / when you're older."

When unschoolers discuss limits they're often discussing arbitrary limits, trumped up to make the parents feel good, or used as magical talismans to guarantee that their children will be creative, healthy and safe. What creates much more magic is to help children discover and do and be.

SandraDodd.com/limits
photo by Sandra Dodd
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Discover and do and be

"Conventional wisdom" (those truisms that too-often aren't true) says "children need limits," and that good parents have lots of limits (the more limits the better the parent). We've all seen (and some have been in) families where stifling limits caused the very problems they were expected to prevent. But without a counter-mantra to "children need limits" it's easy for parents to fear that it must be true or people wouldn't keep saying it.

If by "limits" people mean "safe boundaries," sure! If by "limits" people mean "someone to watch and care," absolutely! But what people usually mean by "limits" is parents who say "no / don't / stop / forget it / when you're older."

When unschoolers discuss limits they're often discussing arbitrary limits, trumped up to make the parents feel good, or used as magical talismans to guarantee that their children will be creative, healthy and safe. What creates much more magic is to help children discover and do and be.

SandraDodd.com/limits
photo by Brittany Lee Moffatt

"Trying 'no limits'"

Someone wrote:

I see so many families trying 'no limits' and then…

I responded:

Two problems: "trying" and "no limits." If a kid knows the parent is only "trying" something, he will certainly take all he can get, desperately and in a frenzy.

"No limits" is not something any family should believe in, or promise their children The world has limits of all sorts. Parents don't need to add to that, but parents can't guarantee "no limits." They CAN give children lots of choices and options.

Gradual change would have helped.

Saying yes a thousand little times is better for everyone than one big confusing "Yes forever, don't care, OH WAIT! Take it back."

SandraDodd.com/cairns
photo by Sandra Dodd (in Albuquerque)

Nearly natural limits

Kelly Lovejoy wrote:

The world is FULL of natural limits. Our lives are FULL of natural limits. It's the way we deal with those limits that matters. Finding solutions and dealing with obstacles and knowing what limits are real.

—Kelly Lovejoy

From a discussion of Boundaries, at Unschooling Basics
photo by Ester Siroky

Arbitrary rules and limits

Arbitrary rules and limits have the characteristic that they entice kids to think about how they can get around them and can even entice kids to cheat and lie. I know a couple of really really great unschooled kids whose parents set limits on their computer use time. The kids used to get up in the middle of the night to use the computer while their parents were asleep. It is an unintended but very very predictable side effect of rules and limits that they always set parents and children up as adversaries (the parents are setting the rules and the children are being required to obey them &mash; these are adversarial positions) and can lead to kids feeling guilty and sneaky when they inevitably bend or even outright break the rules. Avoiding that kind of possibility is one really good reason for not having rules or limits at all.

Coercion creates resistance and reduces learning.

—Pam Sorooshian
(in an obscure discussion from 2004)

SandraDodd.com/control
photo by Chelsea Thurman Artisan
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Limiting Limitations

There are arbitrary limits that parents just make up, or copy from the neighbors. Then there are limits that have to do with laws, rules, courtesy, tact, circumstances, traditions and etiquette.

SandraDodd.com/coaching
photo by Sandra Dodd
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Limiting limitations

There are arbitrary limits that parents just make up, or copy from the neighbors. Then there are limits that have to do with laws, rules, courtesy, tact, circumstances, traditions and etiquette.

SandraDodd.com/coaching
photo by Sandra Dodd
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Transformations

Choices have transformed our lives. Limitations do not transform lives. They limit lives.

SandraDodd.com/limits
photo by Sandra Dodd
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If you want to listen to me talking about transformations, here. "Something big starts to change."

Rainbows on cookies

I'm singing in my head, "Rainbows on cookies, and whiskers on kittens..." Not a good combination, perhaps, as sanitation goes, but I wanted to mention combinations.

People can be single-minded and see the world in a granulated form, as individual, unrelated things, but that limits learning. Sometimes two things meet unexpectedly, and happily, and new thoughts arise. Look for those connections and welcome them!

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If you want to sing along with "Rainbows on cookies," here is a link to an interestingly illustrated version of the song, sung by Julie Andrews (with the original words).

Photo by Holly Dodd
Cookies by Sandra Dodd
Rainbow by a combination of the sun and a crystal in the kitchen window

Support children's interests

"A child can only be six for one year. And sometimes there is a small window of time where a child finds a thing intriguing and wonderful and if it's missed it can never be experienced again in quite the same stirring and magical way."

—Deb Lewis

Read what this was about here: SandraDodd.com/limits/listening
photo by Sandra Dodd

The quote was found and shared on facebook by Allison Hollis Batey. I fixed up its home page after she quoted it. Thanks, Allison!

Too much of "too much"

Some people seem terrified of a monster they have imagined called "Screen Time."

I don't see them trying to put limits on paper time, or cloth time, or time with other people. I've never heard anyone say "That's enough 'imagination time' now."

SandraDodd.com/screentime

Photo by Robin Yaeger! Several people took photos that night and if you click it you can see others of an impromptu Beatles Rock Band fest that took place during the Monkeyplatter Festival in 2009.

Love in the moment

Deb Lewis wrote:

One of the beautiful things about unschooling is it gives our kids time to really explore the things they love—to see where they might lead. And if they don't lead to a career or life-long hobby, the love of the thing, in the moment, is still a valuable experience. If you could magically know what would give your child joy, wouldn't you want to provide it? The magic is in trusting our kids to know what they want and in helping them do as much of that as we possibly can. It's not always easy or comfortable, but how do you put a price on learning and joy?

—Deb Lewis

SandraDodd.com/limits/listening
photo by Stephanie Guthaus
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Books, directly deposited

Deb Lewis wrote:

Listening to audio books is a wonderful way for kids to experience great stories beyond what they'd be able to read on their own. (And beyond what their moms have voice for!)

SandraDodd.com/limits/listening
photo by Sandra Dodd

A happy, good example

Deb Lewis, to a mom advocating limits and control:

If you have been fighting over chores it may be a long time before she feels like helping you. But for the rest of the time you have with her, you can be a good example of a person who happily takes care of her home and who respects and values her child above housework. That will have benefits for your child well beyond required chores.

—Deb Lewis

SandraDodd.com/deblewis/
photo by Sandra Dodd

"The protagonist has a need"

Someone asked:

When kids get sneaky, what might that signal to a parent?

Joyce responded:

Don't see his behavior through adult eyes. That view casts children as the bad guys when they disobey what adults want them to do. See the behavior for what it is. He has a need. He sees you as an obstacle, as someone who not only won't help him meet his need but will probably stop him. So he's avoiding the obstacle to try to meet the need himself.

It's the essence of every story: The protagonist has a need. He finds ways around what stands between him and what he needs.

Rather than being an obstacle, be his partner in meeting his needs. Be the one keeping an eye on the needs of those around him as you find respectful, safe, doable ways for him to meet his needs. Be the one manipulating the environment so he's not in a situation he can't handle yet.

—Joyce Fetteroll
SandraDodd.com/needs

Arbitrary rules and limits
photo by Cátia Maciel
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Limits are limiting!

I have heard of, read about and communicated with people who referred to themselves as part-time unschoolers, relaxed homeschoolers, eclectic homeschoolers, academic unschoolers and other terms.. . . .
Limited kinds of unschooling will have limited benefits.

The Big Book of Unschooling, page 41 (or try 45)
which leads in to SandraDodd.com/unschool/vsRelaxedHomeschooling
and SandraDodd.com/unschool/marginal
photo by Sandra Dodd

Read, try, wait and watch

Read a little. Try a little. Don't do what you don't understand.

Wait a while. You probably won't see an immediate change. But don't pull your plants up by the roots to see if they're growing. That's not good for any plants or for any children. Be patient. Trust that learning can happen if you give it time and if you give it space.

Watch your own children. Are they calm? Are they happy? Are they curious and interested in things? Don't mar their calm or their happiness with arbitrary limits, or with shame, or with pressure. Be their partner.

SandraDodd.com/video/doright
photo by Sandra Dodd
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From the inside...

Debbie Regan wrote:

"From the outside, unschooling may look like no chores, no bedtimes, no education, no discipline, no structure, no limits, etc. But from the inside, it's about learning, relationships, living with real parameters, partnership, navigating turbulence, making connections, joy, curiosity, focus, enthusiasm, options, following trails, fun, growing understanding, opening doors..."

—Debbie Regan

the original
photo by Kathryn Robles
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Words can block thought

Have you considered putting limits on paper time?
       Cloth time?
               Other-human time?

I wrote that when the umpteenth person asked why unschoolers weren't limiting children's "screentime," without being able to break that down into what a child was actually doing.

Beyond the door
photo by Cátia Maciel
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Flexibility

Children sometimes see things "wrong," or from the perspective of someone small and looking up, or just new to the world. Rather than correcting them, which limits their perspective, consider following their line of thought to see how they're coming up with their conclusions, definitions, or theories.

A chair is not "just a chair," if you're lucky. SandraDodd.com/just
photo by Karen James