Fun and wonderful

Once someone chose the subject line "Battle with candy", in a discussion, and one response was (from me):

The candy isn't fighting back. It's a battle with fear and control, if it's a battle at all. But it's not a battle with candy.

Also me, there:

A focus on what is fun and wonderful is better than a focus on discomfort. Candy can be fun and wonderful. A parent saying "no" and calling joy "strung out" isn't nearly as fun or as wonderful.

SandraDodd.com/positivity
photo by Cally Brown

The value of joy

Parents and teachers Don't KNOW, when they look at a six-year-old, what fields of expertise will develop and be needed in the next twelve or twenty years.

The world is changing fast, and one of the best things kids can have is curiosity, openness to newness, and calm confidence that they can pursue their own interests.

If parents are looking at children's interests as school checklists, unschooling is escaping them. Often unschoolers look at children instead of looking more at their own beliefs, and their awareness of what learning looks like in the wild, and how valuable JOY is in a family.

The text was new in a discussion yesterday, but this is a better link:
How to Be a Good Unschooler
by Pam Sorooshian
photo by Christine Milne

Integration

Joyce Fetteroll, from "Why You Can’t Let Go":

As kids fit pieces in one area of the puzzle, those pieces are also unconsciously fitting into other areas. And even better, the areas the piece fits into can provide feedback. So one area can set off an alarm if a child is about to add a piece to another area that doesn't make sense.

As an example, learning about hawks will add pieces to the carnivore area along with lots of other areas too. The carnivore area will also get pieces from cats and dogs and T. Rexes and sharks. That will build up images of carnivore behavior. So if a child hears "Hawks eat rice," that piece won't make sense in the carnivore area. The child's brain will scramble around looking for words that are in both the sounds-like-rice area and the carnivore area. They'll probably say, "Oh, mice!" Or, if they come up blank, "That can't be right!" Whatever they do, they won't just mindlessly accept some fact. They want the areas to work and want the areas to meet their needs.

Yes, there's double-checking with curriculum too. Kids won't just accept some obvious error like 2+2=5. But with natural learning they're motivated to question and understand. They're trying to meet their needs, after all. Not someone else's needs. Not some future needs they might have.

If you think about how your kids are learning English, you can see a working image of this puzzle building. English is an area of the real world puzzle. The more kids use English, the more pieces they add to the English puzzle area. But English is also a tool kids use to build other areas of the real world puzzle.

—Joyce Fetteroll

SandraDodd.com/joyce/talk
photo by Karen James

Stillness comes and goes

Sometimes I get still. That's good, because sometimes I don't, and can't. If I were that zippy all the time, my body, mind and soul would probably wear out.

. . . .
When I was younger and I would change, I thought something was wrong with me. I was under the mistaken impression that personality and mood should be constants. Life is better when I think of those fluctuations as tides, or as the weather of the soul.

Cocooning and other stillness
photo by Teresa Phillips

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P.S. "The Missing Link" from yesterday's Wild Math is repaired.

Don't be arbitrary

Someone wrote that the best thing she had learned from me in unschooling discussions was "Don't be arbitrary."

The writing below came in my response to that.

---

Consistency isn't magic. If a parent isn't using judgment in individual instances, but is just going by rules, it's not better than being arbitrary.

There SHOULD be times when kids can be louder and wilder, and times when parents are especially generous, and times when everyone should chill, and it's not a good time to spend money.

"It depends" is a good answer. Decision making based on the reality of the moment is more valuable than "consistency" or arbitrary decisions.

SandraDodd.com/depends
photo by Nina Haley

Understanding

Joyce Fetteroll wrote, twelve years ago:

Natural learning is easy to understand. It's not so easy to feel confident that natural learning is as good as (let alone better) than institutional learning. Natural learning *shouldn't* test as well as school learning. It isn't geared to passing tests. It's geared to understanding. And understanding is hard to test for!

If natural learning were easy to trust Sandra could have put up on her website:

Create a rich environment. Support and feed their interests. Connect with them.

And none of us would still be sitting here nearly 20 years later, still explaining that it does work. 😉

—Joyce Fetteroll

SandraDodd.com/simple
photo by Christine Milne

Busy, curious and open

People ask whether unschooling isn't like unit studies. Perhaps in the same way there are hexagonal and pentagonal patterns in nature it is. Mathematicians didn't design the patterns in flowers and starfish, but they see them and name them after the fact. I see, in retrospect, a "water unit," but the best thing I can see in the future is to remain busy, curious, and open to whatever comes along. Flexibility to pursue tangents and cowtrails, and continuing to see the wonder in everyday things will lead to learning experiences without prior planning.

A butterfly in the yard is more wonderful than a dusty butterfly pinned in a box, but you can control the one in the box better, as long as you don't want it to fly. At least it will be there when you want to look at it. The one in the yard is on his own schedule.

SandraDodd.com/puddle
photo by Collen Prieto
(Karner blue, Concord, NH)

Limits? Focus elsewhere.

Carol Brown, responding to the comment "Not being able to read can limit them":

They are also limited by their lack of height—but I'm not going to stretch them on the rack each night, to try and fix that.🙂 They are limited by not being able to drive—but I wouldn't let a 6 yo drive my car to the library! Reading is just one of many things they are limited by. I have found it is better to focus on the things they can do, or can nearly do, and help where they want help, rather than try to make / bribe / tempt / cajole / whatever / them into trying to learn things they aren't ready for. And many kids, especially boys, but some girls too, simply aren't ready for reading until later.

The main problem for a late reader is the negative input from others. Homeschool kids can be protected from a lot of that—providing the parents aren't the ones exuding the negativity!

—Carol Brown

SandraDodd.com/r/carolbrown
photo by Rippy Dusseldorp/Ripandeep Saran
(her boy, not one of Carol's)

One seamless whole

Tina Bragdon wrote:

More and more I am beginning to understand what you say about the power of our words, the semantics of them, and what they reveal about our thoughts deep down. I used to think long ago this was a bit nitpicky, but really can see what you mean when I really stop and think about it.

I think that awareness (for me anyway) is easier to come by with some of our loaded words like "lazy", "she-he always/never.." and such, but most of us weren't homeschooled let alone unschooled and as such don't realize the impact of being graded, sorted, and categorized from the age of 2-3 or so (ie-being regarded as "toddler", preschooler" and so on).

The more I take the word "teach" out of my vocabulary and am conscious of it the better it is for me and the easier it is to see my children's lives as one seamless whole and not divided by subjects.

—Tina Bragdon

The School in my Head

Mindful of Words

SandraDodd.com/subjects
photo by Holly Dodd

A world of partnership

In a world of choices, every choice that moves one toward positivity (hope, optimism, joy, sweetness, peace) and away from negativity (cynicism, anger, disdain, dismay, pessimism) is a solid step toward "better" (IF the person wants to be more positive).

In a world of partnership, when one partner is more positive, the partnership is more positive.

In a home with a mother, when the mother is more positive, the family's life is more positive.

SandraDodd.com/choices
photo by Sandra Dodd
of Kirby, Keith and Marty
35+ years ago

Out of order

The past few days have been glitchy, but I was calm, from years of practice.

Yesterday's post was lacking a link to something I think you might enjoy. My question and the beginning of the response are here, and it should link to the rest (but scroll up, there):

Sandra: why does freeze frame sound like the Ramones or Devo ChatGPT: If by "Freeze-Frame" you mean the 1981 hit by The J. Geils Band, I can hear why it might remind you of both Ramones and Devo, even though it isn't really either one. A few things overlap:...

If I had a graph of the order in which I've learned different kinds of music, it would seem glitchy, too. I'm still figuring out lots of things I missed while I was more involved in traditional music, English ballads, madrigals, and medieval and Renaissance Christmas music. Some of that was singular, or duets. Some was leading groups of people. Keith and I spent years immersed in the Society for Creative Anachronism, and weren't paying much attention to what was new and current.

Keith was in high school, listening to The J. Geils Band, The Doobie Brothers, Steppenwolf and Jethro Tull, while I was at the University of New Mexico, playing in the first iteration of their early music program (then called "The Keller Consort"). I listened to albums, but not much radio. I was "studying" Elton John, Cat Stevens, and Joni Mitchell.

Keith and I have been a couple for over 45 years and have done vocal and instrumental music together, and shared each others' old favorite music. He didn't know anything about Donovan, and I think he knew Paul McCartney and Wings better than he knew The Beatles. I couldn't tell Steely Dan from The Doobie Brothers.

It still works if things are learned out of order. When I was little, I could read music before I could read words. Music is in and around me.

I'm still curious, and I'm still learning.

SandraDodd.com/connections
photo by Holly Dodd

P.S. Keith still goes to SCA events and does music. I wandered off.

Fear of media, and of newness

Yesterday I sent an extra post by accident. The one about TV wasn't ready, but it still works. I had planned to make a webpage with photos of more poster boards with people's notes about what they had learned from different shows. When I've done that, someday, I'll post it again.

It's hard for people to conceive of how fearful people were of television viewing, or of video games, just two or three decades ago. I myself missed out on the days when reading novels had been considered a trashy activity. I knew, somewhat, about adults' fear of comic books, when I was a kid; teachers would confiscate comics and not give them back, sometimes.

Time has passed and these days the scary edge of unfamiliar technology is AI, such as Chat GPT and Claude. Alexa is getting in there more. Google's AI has recently started having longer exchanges if you ask questions. I hope Google AI will get better; that one I don't trust as much.

My experience with Chat GPT is that if you ask a philosophical question, or tell a story, or start a conversation, you might have a lot of fun. Start with something you know and care about.

If you use one of these links, it will open at the end of the exchange. Scroll up if you want the beginning. Some of the questions I've asked have been

• why does freeze frame sound like the Ramones or Devo (I kept my original question format—not really formatted...)
  
  
• Was "Encino Man" a direct take-off on "ET the Extraterrestrial"?
  
  
• What rock or pop singers have voices that could have performed in a 19th century music hall without amplification?

Mostly I like to explore musical topics, but I asked about why my front-yard apple tree has so many apples though it didn't last year; cooking questions and ideas; which kinds of intelligences are best served by exchanges with AI; mysteries about a new medication I'm taking that's to be mixed with juice—about which juices weren't working well, one way or another (settled on tangerine juice); various details about the UK series "Shetland"; taxidermy and the series "Vera"... I've gotten feedback and ideas on traditional ballads (I used to collect and sing them in my teens and 20s), and fairytales/archetypes/psychology of identity. It's a way for me to bounce ideas around and get input on trivial topics, usually, and the discussions are fun.

If the thought of that scares or offends you, think about why. Consider asking Chat GPT or Claude why. Google's AI probably doesn't know.

It's a tool and a toy and you'll still be safe at home. Be brave, about learning.

If you wonder something, and you don't have friends who know, or who would let you roll the question around until you were tired of it, consider AI like a Magic 8 Ball, or a Ouija Board, if those are less scary. It's way better than either.

Fear itself
photo by Catherine Forest
of Watersprite Lake

Every area of life

Janine Davies, responding to this quote:

Unschooling can make life better. Really, fully unschooling becomes more philosophical and spiritual than people expect it to.

—Sandra Dodd

I have acknowledged my experience of this before now when I first really 'got' and fully applied radical unschooling, and now with each day, month, year, this becomes stronger and stronger in my experience.

It's exhilarating to me, the transformative power of unschooling. It is the thing that has finally drained negativity out of my life and pushed me daily further and further away from it, and further and further towards positivity in every area of my life.

—Janine Davies

SandraDodd.com/positivity
photo by Holly Dodd

Snapshot

Things change. Babies grow. Young parents get older.

See what you have. Remember what is good, from this moment, from this time.

What is not memorably good, perhaps you can make better for the next moment.

SandraDodd.com/gratitude
photo by Lydia Koltai, a beautiful selfie

Breathe to think

Rachel S:

The hardest part for me is catching yourself in the moment and being aware enough to make the better choice that aligns with where you want to be. Luckily we have multiple opportunities daily to do so.😊

Sandra D:

If you didn't "catch yourself," that was one of those "acted thoughtlessly" moments.

Because you switched from "me" to "yourself/you," and talked about "catching yourself," I think you're seeing it as an outside influence—part of you is catching the other part of you. That's too much work and worry!

What helped me, when I had babies, was breathing before I spoke or before I decided, and eventually, taking a breath when I felt my thoughts get zippy-fast. I didn't always do it, but increasingly, many times a day, I did. Before long it was most of the time. That was growth. That was good.

Rachel S:

Yes I have started to try and stop and breath. It seems so foreign at times like I have to fill the space with something! The knee jerk conditioning is so strong at times but as you say it takes practice and eventually a new path will be laid. Thank you for replying. It has given me insight.

(original, in the comments at "Growth is good")
SandraDodd.com/breathing
photo by Nina Haley

Choosing, many times

Note from a discussion in February 2012:

"I totally understand the idea behind radical unschooling, that children will self regulate...."

It surprises me every time someone assures others that they COMPLETELY and absolutely understand that... and then make a statement that came from somewhere else. "Self-regulate" means "eventually do what the mom wanted, spontaneously," sometimes, and other times means that the child will begin to have "self control" and tell himself no. A lot.

It's much clearer to think of a child having choices, and making what seems like the best one, many times a day; many times an hour, sometimes. A kid surrounded by cows and mesquite might not want to go out there, again, just to go. A kid who lives in a cornfield isn't likely to run excitedly out to see that... again.

Marty's off at a park in armor, where he's gone most Sundays for five or six years (and half the Sundays of his life before that). Holly was out and about most of yesterday. They chose to be out. They weren't out because their mom told them it was better than a Wii.

—Sandra Dodd

SandraDodd.com/self-regulation
photo by Sandra Dodd, of Bardolf (Marty)

The red belt in the photo meant he was a squire. Now his belt is white (for knighthood), and he has been Baron of al-Barran, King of the Outlands, and Prince of Oertha. That will mean something or nothing, depending who's reading; that's fine.

More careful than "authentic"

Once upon a time in 2007, I was responding to a mom who was being dismissive (of her children) and defensive (of the discussion):

---

She:

I think that because of the tool we are using here to communicate that something is lost in translation.

I:

Don't try to use a saw as a hammer.

The tool we're using here can be used very well, but it takes thought and practice. No one is preventing reflection and proofreading. It's fine (and would be good) for you to hold a post and edit it carefully. Those who choose not to shouldn't complain about reactions.

She:

As powerful as words can be, the right attitude and heart behind the mistake can change how the words were perceived.

I:

Words can harm children forever. You're very unlikely to traumatize any of the moms reading here, but we can help you learn not to traumatize your children, and to think and write more clearly, if you want.

She:

Sandra also said, "Watch your thoughts, because without doing that you can't really learn to choose better reactions."
I agree with this in part.

I:

IN PART?

SandraDodd.com/authentic
photo by Rosie Moon

Clearly powerful words

In a discussion unrelated to this, I had written:

There are no "preschoolers" when you're not planning to send a child to school. There are young children. In the same way that it's better, for unschoolers, to say a child is eight than that he is a third grader, the designation "pre-schooler" is jarring.

Tina Bragdon wrote:

Thank you, Sandra for posting this! More and more I am beginning to understand what you say about the power of our words, the semantics of them, and what they reveal about our thoughts deep down. I used to think long ago this was a bit nitpicky, but really can see what you mean when I really stop and think about it.

SandraDodd.com/subjects
photo by Annie Regan

Deschooling and Games

Lyle Perry was one of my favorite unschooling-volunteer-helper writers, and the following were his responses to someone who shall remain nameless, who was complaining about Yu-Gi-Oh. The indented sections are Lyle's pull-punches-gently responses. —Sandra

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I wonder when he will ever learn anything!

Maybe he's wondering when you will ever SEE what he's learning. Maybe he's wondering when you will join him in what he's learning, or at least express some joy and satisfaction that he IS learning. (He IS learning, you know.)

That's all he talks about. Yu-Gi-Yo Cards

What do you talk about? Anything BUT Yu-Gi-Oh cards? It sounds like you're waiting for him to get through a "phase" or something so he can really get down to some serious learning. The problem is, he's already there, he's just waiting for you to catch up! You're the one that's behind. He's doing the learning, he's moved on, and you're still stuck on the same chapter. It's time to turn the page. Or better yet, put that book down, wrap it in some gasoline soaked newspapers, and offer it up as your last sacrifice to the School Gods. Their powers are obsolete now. Break free from the academic death grip they have on your mind and set yourself free!

And he doesn't know how to play the game, and I am so not interested in trying to teach the game.

Well, that's a pretty depressing attitude. Would you be interested in teaching him geography? Biology? Seismology? Are those the important things? Your things are important and his things are crap? If that's true, I don't blame him for not being interested in your stuff. Why should he get excited about your stuff when you look at his stuff with disdain and revulsion? Don't forget that he's learning something about the signals you're sending him too. He's learning ALL the time. Don't let him learn that his mom thinks what he does is stupid.

—Lyle Perry, the responses
(more here)

SandraDodd.com/focus
photo by Colleen Prieto

Even more relaxed

Ren wrote:

The part that is missing with the relaxed/eclectic approach is still trust. It's just being more creative with how you get information into children, that's all. Better....but not quite the complete trust that unschoolers have in the human ability to learn.

We may still raise butterflies or garden or go to museums, so to an outsider we're doing some of the same activities. The difference is my kids can show zero interest and that is just fine. The difference is that I'm not trying to check of some subject box or define their learning experiences for them. The difference is that we do these things to have fun and trust that learning happens when we're alive and breathing. 🙂

—Ren Allen

SandraDodd.com/unschool/vsRelaxedHomeschooling
photo by Nicole Kenyon