Never heard of such a thing

Christine Macdonald wrote that she and her daughter had walked to the grocery store once to pick up milk they needed for a recipe:

I had brought a ten-dollar bill (no wallet) I told her we'd have about six dollars left and she could get whatever she wanted with it—she wanted a pomegranate or three artichokes (neither of which we had enough money left for) I told her we could come back later with my wallet and get them or get them now skip the milk and come back later for the milk to finish our cake. She said come back later for the artichokes. When we were at the checkout I said why don't you just get a candy bar or something for the walk home she said no thanks. A mom behind me in line was shocked at the idea of a kid not wanting candy if offered said she never heard of such a thing.

—Christine Macdonald

SandraDodd.com/eating/sweets
photo by Jihong Tang

Real, present, thinking children

Sandra Dodd, 2014, commentary on criticism:

How parents can ignore their own real, present, thinking children in favor of vague negativity and scare stories is a mystery.

Unschooling is not synonymous with anything. There are people who "unschool" except for…", and who "unschool mostly," but if their priorities are learning and peace, then arbitrary rules and decisions made on fear are less likely to seem like good ideas.

If an 11 year old is bummed, it might be worth really looking at his side of things. Being a child's partner in exploring the world is valuable in more ways than people can imagine, if they haven't done it. If the parent sees the child as an adversary who should be limited and made to wait until he's grown even to spend his own money, there will be more problems than they can imagine.

SandraDodd.com/partners/child

---

I've added that to the page Look Directly at your Child

The full text with background and discussion is here on Always Learning.

photo by Lydia Koltai

Knowing needs

Anna Black (in Australia, so the cookies and biscuits were same and sweet):

Today we were driving home from the library discussing what we would eat. Usually we go to a cafe after the library, but we are saving money for an aquarium visit on Wednesday so I offered to make milkshakes and cinnamon butter cookies at home, which both kids love. My six year old was enthusiastic, but then said, "I think I'm too hungry for biscuits. I'd like something more filling and not sweet." She ended up having a bowl of tuna and mayonnaise, followed by a milkshake. I am so glad she can listen to what her body needs and choose accordingly.

Sandra, responding to that tuna story:

When kids don't get enough sweets, their bodies need sweets. When sweets are there, but their parents say "no," then their souls need sweets, and love, and attention, and positive regard. When sweets are treated sweetly, then children can choose tuna over sweets.

SandraDodd.com/eating/sweets
photo by Cátia Maciel

Fifteenth Anniversary!

Images and parts of the text are links.

First post, with some nice comments, from 2010:

This would need more candles now, but...



May the richness and riches of this trove of words and photos seep into your soul and give you sweet dreams and good ideas.

---

With this, there are 5,343 posts. A few were deleted in the past for lacking longevity (announcements, temporary info). Some have been repeated for being especially good. They are labelled four ways, to keep it from being one big label/tag, so if you would like to see some "greatest hits," these are clickable, and are called

again (72 of those)

again! (147)

re-run (151)

repeat (136)

For today, then, if those are excluded, there are 4,837 non-repeated posts. Still around 5,000.

Most posts link to an unschooling page or two on my website. Most of those pages link back to this blog (from a little link in the upper right corner).

If you would like to help fund the maintenance of that site (from which most of the quotes come), there is a donation link at SandraDodd.com (which can also be accessed from this image on most of the unschooling pages:


The donation link is halfway down there. It's PayPal, debit or credit.

I can accept checks or Christmas cards to:

Sandra Dodd
8116 Princess Jeanne NE
Albuquerque NM 87110     USA

(If cool foreign money, save it there; consider photo request below!)

Also useful would be photos for the collection from which I try to pull a match for a text. Not all get used and some get used very late, but it's nice to have a variety. Send just a few you love, so I'm not overwhelmed, and tell me how to credit you (full name or truncated how). Those can go by messenger or by e-mail to Sandra@SandraDodd.com (and larger files are fine).

SandraDodd.com
tree art by Bo King
cake photo by Sandra Dodd
photos by many different people at the repeat/again links

P.S. I want the website to last a long time, so if I'm not able to collect funding assistance someday, maybe find Holly Dodd or Vlad Gurdiga and see if they need financial help keeping it going. It's a bit less than $20 a month these days; might go up as things might do. Thanks.

Helping teens

Written when Holly Dodd was 18 (2009), of when she was in her mid-teens:

Holly has had a few jobs. One was working at a skateboard and clothing store in a mall a few miles away. One was working at a flower shop just a few hundred yards away; she walked. But the shop had another shop on the air base, and sometimes she worked there, so she had a base pass and a key to both shops. When Holly's jobs require driving, we let her use a car. Some of her school-attending friends are told they can't get a job unless they buy a car first. It seems to be a way for the parents to say no and then blame the kids for it.

Some mainstream families press their teenaged children to get jobs, and shame them if they fail, while putting conditions on when and where they can work. The result is that getting a job was just one more "do what the parents make you do" situation, and the jobs aren't fun; they're an extension of school and of parental control.

When teens or young adults have chosen to have a job without desperation for money, and when they are accustomed to learning all the time and living joyfully, they are a different sort of employee.

SandraDodd.com/jobs/bigbook
photo by Cathy Koetsier

364 Days of Learning

Sandra, from a recorded interview:

When people who are running a school, charging money for people to send their kids there, where they will keep them there every day, like the law says, and they're reporting to the state, like the law says, to then equate themselves with what radical unschoolers are doing, it’s cheatery. They are cheating, They are trying to suggest that they can do in 180 days—whatever 6 times 180 is in hours—that they can take the state requirement of hours and create, in that time, what a radical unschooling family can create in 364 days of learning.

Amy:

My audio wasn’t being recorded properly at this point, but here I said something sort of snarky, like “You mean 363 days, because of 'Learn Nothing Day',” because apparently I don’t know how many days there are in a year, and Sandra said:

Sandra Dodd:

I took out the one already, it would have been 365.

Amy:

And we had a pretty good laugh about that. But eventually we got back to talking about the other benefits of unschooling—things that people don’t necessarily think of as "education."

SandraDodd.com/familybonding

Learn Nothing Day (July 24)

Calm and thoughtful joy

What advice do you have for families who are new to homeschooling?

Don't spend money at first. Read, meet other families, let your children have time to do what they're interested in, or what they weren't allowed to do before because of school. If they want to read or play in the yard or ride bikes or watch movies or draw or paint or play games, make that possible for them.

While the children are recovering, the parents can learn about what they want to do and why, and how. There is more online about homeschooling than anyone could ever read. Find the writers and ideas that make sense to you, and pursue that. Don't rush into anything. Parents should learn to be calm and thoughtful instead of panicky and reactionary. It's better for health and decision-making, and it sets a good example for the children. Don't live in fear when you can live in joy.

SandraDodd.com/beginning
photo by Cátia Maciel

Peace and optimism

Jenny Cyphers wrote:

While I don't deny that money can make an unschooling life easier, and that affording opportunities can contribute to a rich full unschooling life, it isn't everything. It can be worked around. Creating peace and optimism and comfort and trusting relationships are bigger and it shows through in times when things are less than ideal.

—Jenny Cyphers

SandraDodd.com/teen/people
photo by Gail Higgins

Avoiding problems

What else can be a problem with unschooling?
Trying to save time and money; skimping on attention.

I've done this, "Not now," or "please not today." But what do you tell yourself about that? If it's "Good, no problem," that's bad, and a problem.

Generosity begets generosity
photo by Roya Dedeaux

How much?

Unschooling doesn't need to be expensive, but anyone choosing unschooling simply to save money is making a mistake. If parents don't want to spend any money on games, toys, museums, out-of-town trips, books, or whatever it is the kids might be interested in, then unschooling will not work at their house.

One doesn't need to be rich to unschool, but it takes dedication and focus, creativity and resourcefulness.

SandraDodd.com/unschoolingcost
photo by Jihong Tang

Learning-and-living jobs

Some mainstream families press their teenaged children to get jobs, and shame them if they fail, while putting conditions on when and where they can work. The result is that getting a job was just one more "do what the parents make you do" situation, and the jobs aren't fun; they're an extension of school and of parental control.

When teens or young adults have chosen to have a job without desperation for money, and when they are accustomed to learning all the time and living joyfully, they are a different sort of employee.

SandraDodd.com/jobs/bigbook
gif by Holly Dodd

Negotiations, commerce (not bribery)

I think we were discussing offering an older child money to read to a younger child, or to play with them at their level; kind of an occasional in-house mother's helper situation. Someone asked about bribery; my response follows. —Sandra

How do you go about it without it feeling like/being bribery? I'm guessing it is in attitude and wording, but I can't imagine a way to word it that it doesn't sound like bribery to me...? Thanks for the idea!

How do places of business get people to go to work without "bribery"?
How do you get an auto dealer to give you a car without bribery?

If someone's supposed to do something anyway and holds out on you until you pay them or give them something, that's a bribe. If something is not someone's job or someone's property and they negotiate for an exchange, that's commerce, not bribery.

There are some truisms that are spoken without real examination and I think the very vague rules against bribery of children are right up top there.

SandraDodd.com/bribery
photo by Cátia Maciel

Where do you look?

How do you apportion your patience, attention, courtesy, time, money, material help, respect?

Those sorts of decisions make you who you are.


SandraDodd.com/eyecontact
photo by Sandra Dodd

Learning the OTHER things

Sylvia Toyama wrote, in 2004:

This week Andy has figured out money, and it's happened in spurts all week... . . . .
He has learned all this through his own observations. He figured it on his own, when it made sense to him, because it was now important to him to know. And he has the pleasure of knowing he did it without being 'taught' by someone else. He's learned that he's capable and smart — something you just can't get from a worksheet with some arcane facts memorized.

And that's how they reach the point of 'wanting to learn' — when it matters to them, not when it matters to you or anyone else.

—Sylvia Toyama

You can read the details I left out
at SandraDodd.com/math/money
photo by Cátia Maciel

If mathematics is easy for a person...

Disclaimers: Unschooling doesn't ensure mathematical ability.

I wrote this before Marty got a degree in economics. They were 18 or older before taking any classes, and only needed to pay for the books.

---

My kids all caught up with formal math in a semester or two of community college. Marty did up to calculus. Kirby only took one class but makes use of math all the time in his work and play, and is good with money and loans and banking and all that practical life stuff.

Holly took three classes, I think. Maybe two. Liked it; it wasn't difficult. There were people in class with her bemoaning the difficulty, and they had been in school for twelve years or more, taking math classes.

---

That was written in 2014. Their paid employment and their hobbies, since then, have involved some or all of logistics, statistics, financial accounting, coding/programming, inventory and cash handling. What they learned in class was the notation used to communicate mathematical ideas "on paper" in our culture.

Some of their facility might have been inherited genetically from their mathish dad. That's fair, too.

SandraDodd.com/math/schoolmath
photo by Shawn Smythe Haunschild

Say yes when you can

My kids are great at delayed gratification, all of them. They have saved money, earned money, bought small things, and large things, waited for friends to visit, waited for holidays and parties, and because they're busy and secure people, they could always find something to do. But they were also generally sure that as soon as it WAS possible, they would do it, or have it. That's because they had lived their lives with parents who were their partners and who helped them, rather than thwarted or frustrated them.

Some kids get to 18 and they're sick and tired of waiting, and they don't want to wait anymore for ANYthing. Some turn to drugs, drinking, partying, charge cards, driving too fast... When parents have a choice of saying yes or no, and they choose 'no' because they think it's good for their child, they are putting that pressure and tension in the bank to gain interest.

Say yes when you can, especially if it's about something that will help your child learn. If you can't decide, think "Will he be happy and learn? Will this help with unschooling?"

2013, Sandra
of kids who were in their early- to mid-20s then

SandraDodd.com/no
photo by Holly Dodd
of herself wearing a top from the 1970s that I handed down to her, with an orchid plant rescued from a trash can

The world expands

When people are able to relax into learning without the self-consciousness of whether what they're learning will impress the neighbors or make them more money, the world expands hugely.

Quote from side commentary, but this works:
SandraDodd.com/chores/option
photo by Nina Haley

Discovering resources

Meredith wrote:

Sometimes the money question is about fears of not having enough to make home rich and joyful - can we really afford to unschool? Is it expensive? And the answer is yes and no. It takes a lot of resources, but money is just one kind of resource. Time is another—and a big one. If you don't have time to spend with your kids, then unschooling might not be a good choice. Creativity is a useful resource, especially if you're short on money and/or time - you can get by with less creativity if you have more money, though. Adaptability is one of the most vital resources for unschooling - if you don't adapt well to new circumstances, then all the time, money and creativity in the world won't help if you have a child who can't meet all your expectations.

—Meredith Novak

SandraDodd.com/unschoolingcost
photo by Holly Dodd

Look and rejoice

How much do you need to own to touch a child gently? How much money do you need to have in order to smile?

Look at what you have rather than what you don't have. Look at what is in the world beyond your family and your neighborhood, and rejoice that your child might be able to go out someday and experience things you've never seen or heard or touched or tasted.

SandraDodd.com/abundance
photo by Sandra Dodd, of fried potatoes
in a pan we earned with grocery store points
before we had children

Imaginary advisors

Sandra Dodd, on stored internal messages:

I think of whose voices I've let speak back to me when I'm wondering what to do, what cartoonish characters are in the peanut gallery of my conscience. I have Mr. Jamison who was the best voice coach I ever had. That's when I'm singing, or sometimes when I'm getting gushy about certain kinds of music and a voice (Sam Jamison's) says it's pap. I don't always agree with him, but I wrestle his opinion lots of times when I don't expect to need to.

I have lots of former best friends, neighbors, teachers, relatives. Some have to sit in the dark back rows, and I don't listen to them as much as I once did because I decided their advice was bad. Some are totally situational (music, or money, or cooking). Some are more about philosophy and ethics and compassion, so they sit up in front with the light on them more often.

I don't mind being one of the council of imaginary advisors anyone has. I just hope they'll listen to lots of voices and not follow any of them without really thinking about it or understanding why.

Use your words (with a great comment)
photo by Sandra Dodd